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• Where to find Hg/Git technical support?

  - by Rook

  Posting this as a kind of a favour for a former coleague, so I don't know the exact circumstances, but I'll try to provide as much info as I can ... A friend from my old place of employment (maritime research institute; half government/commercial funding) has asked me if I could find out who provides technical support (commercial) for two major DVCS's of today - Git and Mercurial. They have been using VCS for years now (Subversion while I was there, don't know what they're using now - probably the same), and now they're renewing their software licences (they have to give a plan some time in advance for everything ... then it goes "through the system") and although they will be keeping Subversion as well, they would like to justify beginning of DVCS as an alternative system (most people root for Mercurial since it seems simpler; mostly engineers and physicians there who are not that interested in checking Git repos for corruption and the finer workings of Git, but I believe any one of the two could "pass") - but it has to have a price (can be zero; no problem there) and some sort of official technical support. It is a pro forma matter, but it has to be specified. Most of the people there are using one of the two already, but this has to be specified to be official. So, I'm asking you - do you know where could one go for Git or Mercurial technical support (can be commercial)? Technical forums and the like are out of the question. It has to work on the principle: - I have a problem. - I post a question with the details. - I get an answer in specified time. It can be "we cannot do that." but it has to be an official answer and given in agreed time. I'm sure by now most of you understand what I'm asking, but if not - post a comment or similar. Also, if you think of any reasons which could decide justification of introducing Git/Hg from an technical and administrative viewpoint, feel free to write them down also.

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• Why Freezing when sending email?

  - by Outlaw Lemur

  So i have a kinect program which when it detects a human, it saves images of them and sends your email a notification email, the thing is that when it sends the email, it freezes and stops running, Why does it do this? Email Notification Code: void SendNotificationEmail() { string email = textBox1.Text; string message = "Someone has been detected in your house!\n Go to www.kinected.webs.com to view your photos now!!!!"; System.Net.Mail.MailMessage emailsend = new System.Net.Mail.MailMessage(); emailsend.To.Add(email); emailsend.Subject = "There is an Intruder In Your Home!"; emailsend.From = new System.Net.Mail.MailAddress("[email protected]"); emailsend.Body = message; System.Net.Mail.SmtpClient smtp = new System.Net.Mail.SmtpClient("smtp.mail.yahoo.com."); smtp.Send(emailsend); } When its supposed to fire: void nui_ColorFrameReady2(object sender, ImageFrameReadyEventArgs e) { // 32-bit per pixel, RGBA image xxx PlanarImage Image = e.ImageFrame.Image; //int deltaFrames = totalFrames - lastFrameWithMotion; //if (totalFrames2 <= stopFrameNumber & deltaFrames > 300) { ++totalFrames2; string bb1 = Convert.ToString(totalFrames2); // string file_name_3 = "C:\\Research\\Kinect\\Proposal\\Depth_Img" + bb1 + ".jpg"; xxx string file_name_4 = "C:\\temp\\Kinect1_Img" + bb1 + ".jpg"; video.Source = BitmapSource.Create( Image.Width, Image.Height, 96, 96, PixelFormats.Bgr32, null, Image.Bits, Image.Width * Image.BytesPerPixel); BitmapSource image4 = BitmapSource.Create( Image.Width, Image.Height, 96, 96, PixelFormats.Bgr32, null, Image.Bits, Image.Width * Image.BytesPerPixel); if (PersonDetected == 1) { if (totalFrames2 % 10 == 0) { image4.Save(file_name_4, Coding4Fun.Kinect.Wpf.ImageFormat.Jpeg); SendNotificationEmail(); PersonDetected = 0; // lastFrameWithMotion = totalFrames; // topFrameNumber += 100; } } } } Thanks for any help!

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• What is an effective git process for managing our central code library?

  - by Mathew Byrne

  Quick background: we're a small web agency (3-6 developers at any one time) developing small to medium sized Symfony 1.4 sites. We've used git for a year now, but most of our developers have preferred Subversion and aren't used to a distributed model. For the past 6 months we've put a lot of development time into a central Symfony plugin that powers our custom CMS. This plugin includes a number of features, helpers, base classes etc. that we use to build custom functionality. This plugin is stored in git, but branches wildly as the plugin is used in various products and is pulled from/pushed to constantly. The repository is usually used as a submodule within a major project. The problems we're starting to see now are a large number of Merge conflicts and backwards incompatible changes brought into the repository by developers adding custom functionality in the context of their own project. I've read Vincent Driessen's excellent git branching model and successfully used it for projects in the past, but it doesn't seem to quite apply well to our particular situation; we have a number of projects concurrently using the same core plugin while developing new features for it. What we need is a strategy that provides the following: A methodology for developing major features within the code repository. A way of migrating those features into other projects. A way of versioning the core repository, and of tracking which version each major project uses. A plan for migrating bug fixes back to older versions. A cleaner history that's easier to see where changes have come from. Any suggestions or discussion would be greatly appreciated.

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• How do programmer-seeking employers see Bioinformatics degree?

  - by Max

  I love programming, but I also love biology. Basically Bioinformatics sounds fun to me. However, there is a fat chance that I won't get a Bioinformatics job and will be forced to build my career around regular programming. Therefore a question: does it matter (much) for an employer if he is looking for a regular programmer but finds a Bioinformatics diploma? Or is it the same in the long run as a regular Informatics diploma?

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• Advice for beginner programmer

  - by user3461957

  I am beginner in software development. I noticed when I try to learn one technology let's say .NET I loose my grip over other for example Java. I thought it would be better to concentrate on one technology either Java or .NET to make significant advancement and be an expert, because they can be many details which one can ignore when keeps on changing between technologies. Is my decision right? Do experts choose this approach? Update: Should I pursue my career knowing one technology or not?

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• Developing professionally for iOS, Android and web - an insight

  - by Scott Roberts

  This is not really a question on how to develop all three, I know various cross platform ways and so on. But I more want to know from developer standpoint how hard it is to basically develop iOS, Android and web apps? I am currently in my first job as a mobile/web developer. I have already developed my first iPhone/iPad app and now I have to develop the app for android because the web version I tried just didn't perform as well as needed and web databases just did not seem to make the cut. But I am not sure it's possible to be good at developing all 3 in terms of remembering all the api's etc. I wouldn't say I have an issue with the programming languages just how to use the api's for the various platforms. Also, all the other languages I look at, in my spare time, just feel like I am spreading myself to thin. Is it feasible for one person to be developing ios, android and web apps? Should I think about reducing it to iOS and web based apps? I develop everything by myself, so I have no one to discuss what the best solutions are for everything and I am just trying to workout as I go along. So any cross platform developers out there? Do companies have different teams for different platforms? Any insight would just help me get my head together. Hopefully this question makes sense.

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• Is windows a "second class citizen" in the django community?

  - by Daniel Upton

  I'm currently doing R&D for a web application which we plan to host ourselves initially and then allow customers to self host. My task has been evaluating web frameworks to see which would give us the biggest productivity initially and ease of maintence while also allowing us to easily support deployment to customer controlled environments. Our team has experience with ASP.NET (MVC and Webforms) and Ruby on Rails. Our experience with rails is that windows deployment is a very taboo subject and any questions on IRC or SO are met with knee jerk "why not linux" responses.. However in this case our target market may be running windows or linux servers. Is this also the case in django land? Is it possible with rubbish performance? Is it possible with lost of pain? Is it seen as reasonable and not treated as a completely stupid idea for not wanting to run linux?

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• Rails Book Suggestions [closed]

  - by Solomon081

  Possible Duplicate: Is there a canonical book on Ruby on Rails? I'm looking to learn Ruby on Rails. I already have a small background in Ruby and don't really need a book that covers both, as I ordered the Pickaxe Book a couple days ago. I recently read some of Beginning Ruby on Rails-Steven Holzner, but abandoned that after seeing multiple statements on SO about how terrible the code in it was, and also the fact that it used Rails 1...Just wondering, what is the best book for an ABSOLUTE BEGINNER in Rails?

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• Security in a private web service

  - by Oni

  I am developing a web site and a web service for a small on-line game. Technically, I'll be using Express (node.js) and MongoDB+Redis for the databases. This the structure I came up with: One Express server that will server as the Web Service. This will connect to the databases. One Express server that will provide the web site. It will connect to the Web Service to retrieve and push the information. iOS and Android application will be able to interact with the WebService. Taking into account: It is a small game. The information transferred is not critical. There will NOT be third party applications. At least for the moment. My concern is about which level of security I should use in each of the scenarios: Security of the user playing through web browser Security of the applications and the Web Server connecting to the WS. I have take a look at the different options and: OAuth and/or Https is too much for this scenario, isn't it? Will be a good option to hash the user and password with MD5(or similar) and some salt? I would like to get some directions and investigate by my own rather than getting a response like "you should you use this node.js module..." Thanks in advance,

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• what is best book to learn optimized programming in java [closed]

  - by Abhishek Simon

  Possible Duplicate: Is there a canonical book for learning Java as an experienced developer? Let me elaborate a little: I used to be a C/C++ programmer where I used data structure concept like trees, queues stack etc and tried to optimize as much as possible, minimum no. of loops, variables and tried to make it efficient. It's been a couple of years that I started writing java codes, but it is simply not that efficient in terms of performance, memory intensive etc. To the point: I want to enter programming challenges using java so I need to improve my approach at things I program. So please suggest me some books that can help me learn to program better and have a chance in solving challenges in programming.

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• using svn and mercurial in eclipse for same project

  - by Konstantin Petrukhnov

  Is it possible to have in eclipse 2 "team providers" for same project. E.g. svn and mercurial? So svn will be used to commit to central repository, and mercurial only to work on my PC. E.g. when I get updates from SVN, I commit to mercurial, then I work with mercurial. When everything is ready to go to central place, i commit in SVN. There is no need to integrate change history. Yes, ideally it will be just mercurial, and most probably it will happened later. But for now I want to try some dirty and fast solution if it exist :)

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• Which Java web framework do you recommend for intranet webapp (not content website)?

  - by pregzt

  I'm about to start development of small purpose build intranet web application for small software vendor. It will be administration console of the server managing licenses for off-the-shelf software installed by users. There will be a few users who need to be able to sign in, issue a batch of license codes, revoke some, renew outdated, resolve issues, etc. Bear in mind that my customer requires Java for this solution. I'm seasoned Java programmer and before I used different frameworks to implement webapps, mainly Apache Struts in the past and Spring MVC recently. I was wondering what else could you recommend for such specific intranet webapp. I looked at using Google Web Toolkit (possibly with SmartGWT) Ext JS for fancy widgets in UI and REST back-end in SpringMVC SpringMVC with JQueryUI Could you please think of any piece of recommendation with regard to the choice I'm going to made?

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• How does a self-taught programmer know when he's ready to look for a job?

  - by user645663

  I've been studying computer science on my own for a few years, but I don't personally know anyone who programs. I was wondering how you know when you're ready to start looking for a job? Personally I'm pretty good with Python and Scheme. I know basic data structures and big O. I've written a Scheme interpreter in C and a couple in Scheme and a few other small/medium sized programs. I have a blog, which I'm starting to transfer my knowledge into to be able to "prove" I know how to code. Am I ready to start looking? And on a related note, am I going to be able to get a job with no experience/education?

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• How/where to run the algorithm on large dataset?

  - by niko

  I would like to run the PageRank algorithm on graph with 4 000 000 nodes and around 45 000 000 edges. Currently I use neo4j graph databse and classic relational database (postgres) and for software projects I mostly use C# and Java. Does anyone know what would be the best way to perform a PageRank computation on such graph? Is there any way to modify the PageRank algorithm in order to run it at home computer or server (48GB RAM) or is there any useful cloud service to push the data along the algorithm and retrieve the results? At this stage the project is at the research stage so in case of using cloud service if possible, would like to use such provider that doesn't require much administration and service setup, but instead focus just on running the algorith once and get the results without much overhead administration work.

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• Representing and executing simple rules - framework or custom?

  - by qtips

  I am creating a system where users will be able to subscribe to events, and get notified when the event has occured. Example of events can be phone call durations and costs, phone data traffic notations, and even stock rate changes. Example of events: customer 13532 completed a call with duration 11:45 min and cost $0.4 stock rate for Google decreased with 0.01% Customers can subscribe to events using some simple rules e.g. When stock rate of Google decreases more than 0.5% When the cost of a call of my subscription is over $1 Now, as the set of different rules is currently predefined, I can easily create a custom implemention that applies rules to an event. But if the set of rules could be much larger, and if we also allow for custom rules (e.g. when stock rate of Google decreses more than 0.5% AND stock rate of Apple increases with 0.5%), the system should be able to adapt. I am therefore thinking of a system that can interpret rules using a simple grammer and then apply them. After som research I found that there exists rule-based engines that can be used, but I am unsure as they seem too complicated and may be a little overkill for my situation. Is there a Java framework suited for this area? Should we use framework, a rule engine, or should we create something custom? What are the pros and cons?

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• How does I/O work for large graph databases?

  - by tjb1982

  I should preface this by saying that I'm mostly a front end web developer, trained as a musician, but over the past few years I've been getting more and more into computer science. So one idea I have as a fun toy project to learn about data structures and C programming was to design and implement my own very simple database that would manage an adjacency list of posts. I don't want SQL (maybe I'll do my own query language? I'm just having fun). It should support ACID. It should be capable of storing 1TB let's say. So with that, I was trying to think of how a database even stores data, without regard to data structures necessarily. I'm working on linux, and I've read that in that world "everything is a file," including hardware (like /dev/*), so I think that that obviously has to apply to a database, too, and it clearly does--whether it's MySQL or PostgreSQL or Neo4j, the database itself is a collection of files you can see in the filesystem. That said, there would come a point in scale where loading the entire database into primary memory just wouldn't work, so it doesn't make sense to design it with that mindset (I assume). However, reading from secondary memory would be much slower and regardless some portion of the database has to be in primary memory in order for you to be able to do anything with it. I read this post: Why use a database instead of just saving your data to disk? And I found it difficult to understand how other databases, like SQLite or Neo4j, read and write from secondary memory and are still very fast (faster, it would seem, than simply writing files to the filesystem as the above question suggests). It seems the key is indexing. But even indexes need to be stored in secondary memory. They are inherently smaller than the database itself, but indexes in a very large database might be prohibitively large, too. So my question is how is I/O generally done with large databases like the one I described above that would be at least 1TB storing a big adjacency list? If indexing is more or less the answer, how exactly does indexing work--what data structures should be involved?

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• Are the criticisms against Dart valid?

  - by Hassan

  According to this Wikipedia article, Microsoft, Apple, Mozilla, and others criticize Dart, a programming language Google introduced to work in web browsers, because they feel "it seems harmful (cf. VBScript in IE)". But Dart also compiles to Javascript, so a web application written in Dart can run on any modern browser. So are their concerns valid? Can Dart really be a threat to the web's openness?

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• How do your busiest people transfer their knowledge?

  - by Wikis Commit At Area 51

  We have recently polled our company wide wiki users and found out that there are two large groups of users: people with lots of knowledge but (who claim they have) no time to document people with time but (who claim they have) not enough knowledge worth documenting Each group covered almost 50% of the users! How do your companies handle this? That is, how do you encourage your busiest / most knowledgeable people to share their knowledge?

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• What does your University 1st class mean?

  - by Abimaran

  I know, it's highly subjective question, but, I need the opinion. Please don't close this! IMHO and experience, they (the 1st class fellows) have a the resources (tutorials, past papers, etc), courage and the ability to memorize the answers on that. But, there are some talented peoples, who have the real knowledge with the 1st class. Are those peoples really win in the industries? Please don't ask my class :)

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• Regarding Microsoft MVC framework and usage [closed]

  - by Thomas

  it will be better if some one tell me that what type of web application should develop using Microsoft MVC framework. i am familiar with web form but not familiar with MS MVC framework. i feel any type of web application can be developed with web form. i search google lot to know the specific reason for using MS MVC framework. i am keen interested to know when i should develop web apps using MS MVC framework and when i should use web form. i will be happy if some one discuss this issue in detail. thanks

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• Confusion related to sigwait in multiprocess system

  - by user34790

  I am having difficulty in understanding IPC in multiprocess system. I have this system where there are three child processes that send two types of signals to their process group. There are four types of signal handling processes responsible for a particular type of signal. There is this monitoring process which waits for both the signals and then processes accordingly. When I run this program for a while, the monitoring process doesn't seem to pick up the signal as well as the signal handling process. I could see in the log that the signal is only being generated but not handled at all. My code is given below #include <cstdlib> #include <iostream> #include <iomanip> #include <unistd.h> #include <sys/types.h> #include <sys/wait.h> #include <sys/time.h> #include <signal.h> #include <unistd.h> #include <fcntl.h> #include <cstdio> #include <stdlib.h> #include <stdio.h> #include <pthread.h> using namespace std; double timestamp() { struct timeval tp; gettimeofday(&tp, NULL); return (double)tp.tv_sec + tp.tv_usec / 1000000.; } double getinterval() { srand(time(NULL)); int r = rand()%10 + 1; double s = (double)r/100; } int count; int count_1; int count_2; double time_1[10]; double time_2[10]; pid_t senders[1]; pid_t handlers[4]; pid_t reporter; void catcher(int sig) { printf("Signal catcher called for %d",sig); } int main(int argc, char *argv[]) { void signal_catcher_int(int); pid_t pid,w; int status; if(signal(SIGUSR1, SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("1"); return 1; } if(signal(SIGUSR2 ,SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("2"); return 2; } if(signal(SIGINT,signal_catcher_int) == SIG_ERR) { perror("3"); return 2; } //Registering the signal handler for(int i=0; i<4; i++) { if((pid = fork()) == 0) { cout << i << endl; //struct sigaction sigact; sigset_t sigset; int sig; int result = 0; sigemptyset(&sigset); if(i%2 == 0) { if(signal(SIGUSR2, SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("2"); return 2; } sigaddset(&sigset, SIGUSR1); sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, &sigset, NULL); } else { if(signal(SIGUSR1, SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("2"); return 2; } sigaddset(&sigset, SIGUSR2); sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, &sigset, NULL); } while(true) { int result = sigwait(&sigset, &sig); if(result == 0) { cout << "The caught signal is " << sig << endl; } } exit(0); } else { cout << "Registerd the handler " << pid << endl; handlers[i] = pid; } } //Registering the monitoring process if((pid = fork()) == 0) { sigset_t sigset; int sig; int result = 0; sigemptyset(&sigset); sigaddset(&sigset, SIGUSR1); sigaddset(&sigset, SIGUSR2); sigprocmask(SIG_BLOCK, &sigset, NULL); while(true) { int result = sigwait(&sigset, &sig); if(result == 0) { cout << "The monitored signal is " << sig << endl; } else { cout << "error" << endl; } } } else { reporter = pid; } sleep(3); //Registering the signal generator for(int i=0; i<1; i++) { if((pid = fork()) == 0) { if(signal(SIGUSR1, SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("1"); return 1; } if(signal(SIGUSR2, SIG_IGN) == SIG_ERR) { perror("2"); return 2; } srand(time(0)); while(true) { volatile int signal_id = rand()%2 + 1; cout << "Generating the signal " << signal_id << endl; if(signal_id == 1) { killpg(getpgid(getpid()), SIGUSR1); } else { killpg(getpgid(getpid()), SIGUSR2); } int r = rand()%10 + 1; double s = (double)r/100; sleep(s); } exit(0); } else { cout << "Registered the sender " << pid << endl; senders[i] = pid; } } while(w = wait(&status)) { cout << "Wait on PID " << w << endl; } } void signal_catcher_int(int the_sig) { //cout << "Handling the Ctrl C signal " << endl; for(int i=0; i<1; i++) { kill(senders[i],SIGKILL); } for(int i=0; i<4; i++) { kill(handlers[i],SIGKILL); } kill(reporter,SIGKILL); exit(3); } Any suggestions? Here is a sample of the output as well In the beginning Registerd the handler 9544 Registerd the handler 9545 1 Registerd the handler 9546 Registerd the handler 9547 2 3 0 Registered the sender 9550 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 10 The monitored signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 10 The monitored signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 10 The monitored signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 10 The monitored signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 2 The caught signal is 12 The caught signal is 12 The monitored signal is 12 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 The caught signal is 12 The caught signal is 12 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 12 The monitored signal is 10 The monitored signal is 12 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 The caught signal is 12 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 10 The monitored signal is 10 The caught signal is 12 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 12 The monitored signal is GenThe caught signal is TheThe caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 2 Later on The monitored signal is GenThe monitored signal is 10 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 The caught signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 The caught signal is 12 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 The caught signal is 12 The caught signal is 10 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 2 The caught signal is 10 Generating the signal 2 Generating the signal 1 Generating the signal 1 As you can see initially, the signal was generated and handled both by my signal handlers and monitoring processes. But later on the signal was generated a lot, but it was not quite processes in the same magnitude as before. Further I could see very less signal processing by the monitoring process Can anyone please provide some insights. What's going on?

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• Can the csv format be defined by a regex?

  - by Spencer Rathbun

  A colleague and I have recently argued over whether a pure regex is capable of fully encapsulating the csv format, such that it is capable of parsing all files with any given escape char, quote char, and separator char. The regex need not be capable of changing these chars after creation, but it must not fail on any other edge case. I have argued that this is impossible for just a tokenizer. The only regex that might be able to do this is a very complex PCRE style that moves beyond just tokenizing. I am looking for something along the lines of: ... the csv format is a context free grammar and as such, it is impossible to parse with regex alone ... Or am I wrong? Is it possible to parse csv with just a POSIX regex? For example, if both the escape char and the quote char are ", then these two lines are valid csv: """this is a test.""","" "and he said,""What will be, will be."", to which I replied, ""Surely not!""","moving on to the next field here..."

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• What you don't like in your web-framework of "choice"?

  - by 0101

  Most of the time we don't have a choice were it comes to web-frameworks, in Java every company is using a different one(big thanks to web-framework developers - you will burn in hell). However now I have a choice of picking which framework we will use, I will probably pick the one I know the best since I know how to by-pass its downfalls. In every comparation we will only see what is good in that frameworks and any downfalls will be swept under the carpet. What are the downfalls of most known frameworks?

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• Is this kind of design - a class for Operations On Object - correct?

  - by Mithir

  In our system we have many complex operations which involve many validations and DB activities. One of the main Business functionality could have been designed better. In short, there were no separation of layers, and the code would only work from the scenario in which it was first designed at, and now there were more scenarios (like requests from an API or from other devices) So I had to redesign. I found myself moving all the DB code to objects which acts like Business to DB objects, and I've put all the business logic in an Operator kind of a class, which I've implemented like this: First, I created an object which will hold all the information needed for the operation let's call it InformationObject. Then I created an OperatorObject which will take the InformationObject as a parameter and act on it. The OperatorObject should activate different objects and validate or check for existence or any scenario in which the business logic is compromised and then make the operation according to the information on the InformationObject. So my question is - Is this kind of implementation correct? PS, this Operator only works on a single Business-wise Operation.

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• Ruby or Python?

  - by Bobby Tables

  Hi all, This question is extremely subjective and open-ended. It might even sound like something I should just research for myself and make my own decision. But I'd like to put it out there and get some thoughts from others. Long story short - I burned out with the rat race and am on a self-funded sabbatical this year. Much of it is to take a break from the corporate grind and travel around, but I also want to play around with new technologies and do some self-learning projects, to stay up to speed on programming, and well - I just love tinkering with programming, when there's no pressure! Here's the thing: I am a lifetime C/C++/Java programmer. I'm a bit of a squiggly bracket snob since I've been working with this family of languages for my entire programming career. So I'd like to learn a language which isn't so closely syntactically related to this group. What I'm basically looking for is a language which is relatively general purpose, fun to learn, has some new concepts that are different from C++/Java, and has a good community. A secondary consideration is that it has good web development frameworks. A tertiary consideration is that it's not totally academic (read: there are real world jobs out there using it). I've narrowed it down to Ruby or Python. My impression of Ruby is that it is extremely web oriented - that the only real application of it is as a server side scripting language for doing web stuff (mainly Ruby on Rails). For Python I'm not so sure. TL;DR and to put it as succinctly as possible: which of these would be better for a C++/Java guy to learn to get some new perspectives on programming? And which is more open and general purpose and applicable to a wider set of applications? I'm leaning towards Ruby at the moment, but I worry to an extent that it looks like it's used as nothing but a server side web language.

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