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  • VLAN issues between linux kernels 2.6 / 3.3 in an ESX / Cisco environment

    - by David Griffith
    I shall attempt to explain an issue I have encountered - I have a VM running on esx 4.1 with an interface connected to VLAN800 via an access port on a cisco 3750. It runs linux - kernel 2.6.24, and has about 5 to 10 Mbit of chatter on 10.10.0.0/16 and various multicast addresses to look after. I needed to isolate certain devices from certain other devices on the network, with all of them having to talk to that one VM. No, the address space can't be separated, nor can the networks be easily vlan'd apart. The software on the VM listens to one interface only. Private vlans appear to be the way to go. So as a test, I built a bridge on the VM that globs together the vlans as needed. All good, everything works as expected. But occasionally (sigh) there's some latency that trips up a couple of profinet devices on the network because, you know, you're not really supposed to trunk real-time protocols around the place willy-nilly. I shift it to our test/backup server - works nicely, but I don't want it to be running on the test server as we muck around with that a lot. So I says to myself, "I'll put it on a new VM for testing and tweaking." I download a small linux distro with kernel 3.3, and install as a new VM with a the vlans as separate interfaces for testing. I power up the testing VM - ok. I bring up all the separate interfaces - ok. I can ping the production VM, see all sorts of traffic going past with tshark, etc. I build a bridge and put the primary vlan on it - the production VM running 2.6 immediately loses its multicast traffic - Unicast is fine. (?) I shut down the bridge - still no multicast traffic (!?) I power-cycle the production VM(!?!?) - multicast traffic returns. I trunk everything into the testing VM and create vlan interfaces under linux instead - same result, as soon as I start the bridge.... no multicast on the production VM. Ok, so I take a break and leave things alone. I decide to play with a couple of ubiquiti bullet radios - I'm testing various firmware as a side project. I flash a radio with Open-wrt-12.09. I enable a trunk on a port on a cisco on our network so I can muck around with multiple vlans and SSIDs I power up the radio and connect - ok. I create a vlan interface from the trunk.... the same vlan as the production VM wayyyyy over there, three cisco routers away. Ok. I bridge the vlan interface to the wifi interface and immediately get a phone call. The production VM has (suprise!) lost its multicast traffic. Again, nothing comes back until I power-cycle the VM. What the hell is going on?

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  • Google Chrome 20 fails to start in ubuntu 12.04

    - by criziot
    Several days ago Google Chrome stoped working after an update. If I start it in the terminal I can see the following output: [6:6:4528137750:FATAL:sandbox_init_linux.cc(378)] prctl(PR_SET_NO_NEW_PRIVS) failed: Invalid argument Any idea how to solve this? Chrome version: 20.0.1132.47 Ubuntu: 12.04 x64 Kernel: 3.2.0-21-generic #34-Ubuntu EDIT: It is possible to start chrome with --no-sandbox switch.

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  • Does QEMU's performance (still) lag VirtualBox's and is there a way to improve it without kvm?

    - by Catskul
    I've noticed several articles that have claimed that QEMU is slower than VirtualBox (without hardware assistance) but several are years old, and the newest seemed to be from last year. Is it true that QEMU is slower than VirtualBox? If so why? Are there any tricks to close the performance gap? Some of my host systems do not have virtualization support so I'm especially interested in performance tips that work without the kernel module.

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  • Linux software RAID6: 3 drives offline - how to force online?

    - by Ole Tange
    This is similar to 3 drives fell out of Raid6 mdadm - rebuilding? except that it is not due to a failing cable. Instead the 3rd drive fell offline during rebuild of another drive. The drive failed with: kernel: end_request: I/O error, dev sdc, sector 293732432 kernel: md/raid:md0: read error not correctable (sector 293734224 on sdc). After rebooting both these sectors and the sectors around them are fine. This leads me to believe the error is intermittent and thus the device simply took too long to error correct the sector and remap it. I expect that no data was written to the RAID after it failed. Therefore I hope that if I can kick the last failing device online that the RAID is fine and that the xfs_filesystem is OK, maybe with a few missing recent files. Taking a backup of the disks in the RAID takes 24 hours, so I would prefer that the solution works the first time. I have therefore set up a test scenario: export PRE=3 parallel dd if=/dev/zero of=/tmp/raid${PRE}{} bs=1k count=1000k ::: 1 2 3 4 5 parallel mknod /dev/loop${PRE}{} b 7 ${PRE}{} \; losetup /dev/loop${PRE}{} /tmp/raid${PRE}{} ::: 1 2 3 4 5 mdadm --create /dev/md$PRE -c 4096 --level=6 --raid-devices=5 /dev/loop${PRE}[12345] cat /proc/mdstat mkfs.xfs -f /dev/md$PRE mkdir -p /mnt/disk2 umount -l /mnt/disk2 mount /dev/md$PRE /mnt/disk2 seq 1000 | parallel -j1 mkdir -p /mnt/disk2/{}\;cp /bin/* /mnt/disk2/{}\;sleep 0.5 & mdadm --fail /dev/md$PRE /dev/loop${PRE}3 /dev/loop${PRE}4 cat /proc/mdstat # Assume reboot so no process is using the dir kill %1; sync & kill %1; sync & # Force fail one too many mdadm --fail /dev/md$PRE /dev/loop${PRE}1 parallel --tag -k mdadm -E ::: /dev/loop${PRE}? | grep Upda # loop 2,5 are newest. loop1 almost newest => force add loop1 Next step is to add loop1 back - and this is where I am stuck. After that do a xfs-consistency check. When that works, check that the solution also works on real devices (such a 4 USB sticks).

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  • Can 32-bit print drivers work on 64-bit windows?

    - by Matt
    I'm reading around and it seems that 32 bit drivers do not work under 64 bit windows. Is this true? since 32-bit applications can run under 64 bit windows it seems ridiculous that 32-bit printer drivers cannot. Are printer drivers run at the kernel level? Sounds like we're in for driver hell for our RDP environments.

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  • Installing Hyper-V Integration Components on Linux

    - by Lance Fisher
    Some big news this week was Microsoft released the Hyper-V integration components for Linux source code under the GPL v2. I just installed Ubuntu Server 9.04 in a Hyper-V VM with a Legacy Network Adapter. How do I install the integration components? Do I have to wait until they are included in the kernel?

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  • Weird nfs performance: 1 thread better than 8, 8 better than 2!

    - by Joe
    I'm trying to determine the cause of poor nfs performance between two Xen Virtual Machines (client & server) running on the same host. Specifically, the speed at which I can sequentially read a 1GB file on the client is much lower than what would be expected based on the measured network connection speed between the two VMs and the measured speed of reading the file directly on the server. The VMs are running Ubuntu 9.04 and the server is using the nfs-kernel-server package. According to various NFS tuning resources, changing the number of nfsd threads (in my case kernel threads) can affect performance. Usually this advice is framed in terms of increasing the number from the default of 8 on heavily-used servers. What I find in my current configuration: RPCNFSDCOUNT=8: (default): 13.5-30 seconds to cat a 1GB file on the client so 35-80MB/sec RPCNFSDCOUNT=16: 18s to cat the file 60MB/s RPCNFSDCOUNT=1: 8-9 seconds to cat the file (!!?!) 125MB/s RPCNFSDCOUNT=2: 87s to cat the file 12MB/s I should mention that the file I'm exporting is on a RevoDrive SSD mounted on the server using Xen's PCI-passthrough; on the server I can cat the file in under seconds ( 250MB/s). I am dropping caches on the client before each test. I don't really want to leave the server configured with just one thread as I'm guessing that won't work so well when there are multiple clients, but I might be misunderstanding how that works. I have repeated the tests a few times (changing the server config in between) and the results are fairly consistent. So my question is: why is the best performance with 1 thread? A few other things I have tried changing, to little or no effect: increasing the values of /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ipfrag_low_thresh and /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ipfrag_high_thresh to 512K, 1M from the default 192K,256K increasing the value of /proc/sys/net/core/rmem_default and /proc/sys/net/core/rmem_max to 1M from the default of 128K mounting with client options rsize=32768, wsize=32768 From the output of sar -d I understand that the actual read sizes going to the underlying device are rather small (<100 bytes) but this doesn't cause a problem when reading the file locally on the client. The RevoDrive actually exposes two "SATA" devices /dev/sda and /dev/sdb, then dmraid picks up a fakeRAID-0 striped across them which I have mounted to /mnt/ssd and then bind-mounted to /export/ssd. I've done local tests on my file using both locations and see the good performance mentioned above. If answers/comments ask for more details I will add them.

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  • Can IOS be upgraded on a Cisco Catalyst 6509 switch without downtime?

    - by Massimo
    There's this Cisco Catalyst 6509 switch with 2 (two) supervisor modules; one of them is active, the other is (almost always) in standby. We need to upgrade IOS; current version is 12.2.something (I can check exactly which one, if this does matter). Can this be done without service interruption? Something like "upgrade the standby supervisor, activate it, upgrade the other one"?

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  • Two network cards latency

    - by Ross W
    I'm trying to setup a network architecture where one network is a low-latency low-bandwidth tcp control system (GBit), the other is a high-bandwidth udp (maybe tcp) network that could get saturated (GBit). If I have two NICs inside a server running Linux. What happens to the low-bandwidth/low-latency network when the high-bandwidth gets saturated. Does each Ethernet card get the same amount of priority inside the kernel or would the low-latency network suffer from the high-bandwidth being saturated?

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  • Can a hard poweroff / outage / crash corrupt VMware snapshots?

    - by basic6
    Assuming a host system is running virtual machines (in VMware Workstation) and all their data is on a reliable storage (so no data corruption due to hdd failure). If that host crashes (kernel panic) while a vm is running, files on the virtual filesystem could be corrupted. But there's a snapshot (of the vm), taken before the crash. Is it safe to assume that reverting to the snapshot, the vm will be back in a clean state - or is there any way that this snapshot could have been corrupted by the crash?

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  • How do I reset my PYTHONPATH?

    - by Underyx
    Somehow my PYTHONPATH environment variable got emptied, and now I can't import some downloaded modules. I've tried running the following command to reinstall all Python packages, but it didn't set the variable back to its original value: dpkg-query -W -f '${package}\n' | grep python | xargs -I % sudo apt-get install % --reinstall How do I reinstall the packages so that this gets sorted out? The (Vagrant) box is running Ubuntu 12.04.

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  • How do I upgrade to PHP 5.4 in CentOS 6.3 with yum?

    - by Vicary
    I found some blog posts about this, but it's rather lack of descriptions on possible side effects. I could really use some detailed on these steps: How to add a repo that provides PHP 5.4 into yum Can this seamlessly replaces the current PHP version in CentOS? How can I switch back to the official repo when it supports PHP 5.4? (current 5.3.3 in my system) Will there be any potential to break PHP modules I currently using?

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  • Run script on login with ssh

    - by user912447
    I have a feeling this is quite easy to do but every solution found on google has to do with adding a script to be run whenever someone logs into the machine. What I am looking for is a way to run a script when only I log into the machine. I ssh into a shared computer and need to have it load a couple modules for me and I imagined the easiest way to do this would to just run a script on login. Is there a simple way?

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  • Is there any very bare minimal ftp server for ubuntu that wouldn't conflict with other installed servers?

    - by Disco
    I have installed proftpd with mod-sql modules; i need to have a ftp server that would run on another port (and use a separate authentication scheme) Whenever i try to install vsftpd or pureftpd it simply removes proftpd and dependencies; i'm guessing it's to prevent having conflicts ... Is there any 'very small' ftp server; like run from command line that I could use ? I've searched all around but cannot find ... Any help would be appreciated

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  • looking for a model number recommendation for a network setup of 49 switches [closed]

    - by Bahrain Admin
    im looking to setup a site with 49 edge switches connected by fiber to a central switch. 3 VLANs will be setup to handle data, telephony, and streaming media. each edge switch should have provision for 2 SFP modules for failover, and the core switch needs to have the provision to handle this failover. i'm getting lost on the Cisco site with their specs and recommendations. if anyone could suggest a suitable model number for the core switch and the edge switch, it would be really appreciated.

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  • How to manually check Ubuntu version? (e.g. from hard drive)

    - by tkoomzaaskz
    There is a fast way to check ubuntu version of the system: $ lsb_release -a No LSB modules are available. Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description: Ubuntu 11.10 Release: 11.10 Codename: oneiric But what are the files that store this information and how can I access them? Particularly, I've got an old partition with a dead Linux lying there and I would like to check what was its Ubuntu version. lsb_release -a shows my current Linux version only...

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  • HP ProLiant DL380 G3 Running Windows Server 2000 has crashed between 6-7:30am for the past 5 days

    - by user109717
    I have a HP ProLiant DL380 G3 running Windows Server 2000 that has been crashing everyday between 6-730am. This started when I changed out a failing hard drive 6 days ago. I have looked at the scheduled tasks which does not have anything pertaining to this issue. Below are the only things I see in the system log and some of the dump files. Can this be a hardware issue if this happens at a certain time frame everyday? Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks The previous system shutdown at 6:07:55 AM on 2/7/2012 was unexpected. System Information Agent: Health: The server is operational again. The server has previously been shutdown by the Automatic Server Recovery (ASR) feature and has just become operational again. [SNMP TRAP: 6025 in CPQHLTH.MIB] BugCheck 7A, {3, c0000005, 3400028, 0} Probably caused by : memory_corruption ( nt!MiMakeSystemAddressValidPfn+42 ) Followup: MachineOwner 0: kd !analyze -v * Bugcheck Analysis * * KERNEL_DATA_INPAGE_ERROR (7a) The requested page of kernel data could not be read in. Typically caused by a bad block in the paging file or disk controller error. Also see KERNEL_STACK_INPAGE_ERROR. If the error status is 0xC000000E, 0xC000009C, 0xC000009D or 0xC0000185, it means the disk subsystem has experienced a failure. If the error status is 0xC000009A, then it means the request failed because a filesystem failed to make forward progress. Arguments: Arg1: 00000003, lock type that was held (value 1,2,3, or PTE address) Arg2: c0000005, error status (normally i/o status code) Arg3: 03400028, current process (virtual address for lock type 3, or PTE) Arg4: 00000000, virtual address that could not be in-paged (or PTE contents if arg1 is a PTE address) MODULE_NAME: nt IMAGE_NAME: memory_corruption BugCheck A, {0, 2, 1, 804137d6} Probably caused by : ntkrnlmp.exe ( nt!CcGetVirtualAddress+ba ) * Bugcheck Analysis * * IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL (a) An attempt was made to access a pageable (or completely invalid) address at an interrupt request level (IRQL) that is too high. This is usually caused by drivers using improper addresses. If a kernel debugger is available get the stack backtrace. Arguments: Arg1: 00000000, memory referenced Arg2: 00000002, IRQL Arg3: 00000001, bitfield : bit 0 : value 0 = read operation, 1 = write operation bit 3 : value 0 = not an execute operation, 1 = execute operation (only on chips which support this level of status) Arg4: 804137d6, address which referenced memory MODULE_NAME: nt IMAGE_NAME: ntkrnlmp.exe

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  • constantly crash on video card

    - by Jason Paddle
    I have this problem with my graphic-card(video card). Video card constantly crash because driver stopped. This is the massage that i get: Display driver stopped responding and has recovered. Display driver NVIDIA Windows Kernel Mode Driver , Version 285.62 stopped responding and has successfully recovered. Video card : MSI GTX470 Twin Frozr Motherboard:Asus P8Z68 V-Pro Tried reinstalling drivers but doesn't help. Any ideas what can be ?

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  • Ruby on Rails tutorial problem

    - by RailAddict
    Quick question which I hope is easily answered.. I am following this tutorial: http://oreilly.com/pub/a/ruby/archive/rails.html?page=2 and all is going well until I try create a controller and view it in my browser. The server is running and it shows the default page okay (http://127.0.0.1:3000). I ran ruby script\generate controller MyTest in my command line and it generated the correct folders and files. The problem is, when I go to http://127.0.0.1:3000/My%5FTest/ it says: We're sorry, but something went wrong. We've been notified about this issue and we'll take a look at it shortly. This must be something I have overlooked somewhere. Any help is appreciated! ruby 1.8.6 rails 2.3.4 Just checked my development logs. Here is what it says: /!\ FAILSAFE /!\ Thu Sep 24 02:21:04 +0100 2009 Status: 500 Internal Server Error no such file to load -- sqlite3 C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/site_ruby/1.8/rubygems/custom_require.rb:31:in gem_original_require' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/site_ruby/1.8/rubygems/custom_require.rb:31:in require' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/dependencies.rb:156:in require' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/dependencies.rb:521:in new_constants_in' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/dependencies.rb:156:in require' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/core_ext/kernel/requires.rb:7:in require_library_or_gem' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/core_ext/kernel/reporting.rb:11:in silence_warnings' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.3.4/lib/active_support/core_ext/kernel/requires.rb:5:in require_library_or_gem' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/sqlite3_adapter.rb:10:in sqlite3_connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:223:in send' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:223:in new_connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:245:in checkout_new_connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:188:in checkout' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:184:in loop' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:184:in checkout' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/monitor.rb:242:in synchronize' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:183:in checkout' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:98:in connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:326:in retrieve_connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_specification.rb:123:in retrieve_connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_specification.rb:115:in connection' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/query_cache.rb:9:in cache' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/query_cache.rb:28:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activerecord-2.3.4/lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:361:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/head.rb:9:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/methodoverride.rb:24:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/params_parser.rb:15:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/session/cookie_store.rb:93:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/failsafe.rb:26:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/lock.rb:11:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/lock.rb:11:in synchronize' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/lock.rb:11:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/dispatcher.rb:114:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/reloader.rb:34:in run' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-2.3.4/lib/action_controller/dispatcher.rb:108:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rails-2.3.4/lib/rails/rack/static.rb:31:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/urlmap.rb:46:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/urlmap.rb:40:in each' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/urlmap.rb:40:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rails-2.3.4/lib/rails/rack/log_tailer.rb:17:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/content_length.rb:13:in call' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/handler/webrick.rb:46:in service' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/httpserver.rb:104:in service' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/httpserver.rb:65:in run' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:173:in start_thread' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:162:in start' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:162:in start_thread' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:95:in start' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:92:in each' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:92:in start' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:23:in start' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/1.8/webrick/server.rb:82:in start' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rack-1.0.0/lib/rack/handler/webrick.rb:13:in run' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/rails-2.3.4/lib/commands/server.rb:111 C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/site_ruby/1.8/rubygems/custom_require.rb:31:in gem_original_require' C:/Ruby/lib/ruby/site_ruby/1.8/rubygems/custom_require.rb:31:in `require' script/server:3 I have no idea what this means but one thing I noticed is that it says sqlite3 - I am not using that. I am using MySql. Not sure if this is the problem..

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  • Architecture choice about representation of collections in Business Objects

    - by Rajarshi
    I have made certain choices in my architecture which I request the community to review and comment. I am breaking up the post in smaller sections to make it easier to understand the context and then suggest/comment. I am sorry that the post is long, but is required to explain the context. What am I building A typical business application where there are application users, security roles, business operation/action rights based on roles and several business modules like Stock Receive, Stock Transfer, Sale Order, Sale Invoice, Sale Return, Stock Audit etc. and several reports. The application is a WinForm application since it has a lot of rich and responsive UI requirements and has to operate in disconnected mode (with a local SQL Server), most of the time. What have I done I have built a framework - nothing to boast about, but just a set of libraries that serves the repetative requirements of my application, e.g. authentication, role based authorization, data access, validation, exception handling, logging, change status tracking, presentation model compliance and reasonable loose coupling between components. No, I have not written everything from scratch, you can say I have consolidated many things together like some concepts from CSLA, Martin Fowler for Presentation Model, blocks from Enterprise Library, Unity etc. to build a set of libraries that will help my developers be productive quickly without having to look up Google for many of the technical requirements. I have tried to keep the framework generic so that it can be used in typical business applications and also tried to follow some best practices that will support the same Business Objects to be used in an ASP.NET MVC environment also. My present architecture serves my objectives well, and have built several modules (on WinForm) without much trouble. The architecture also lent itself well to build some usable prototype on ASP.NET MVC with the same set of business objects, without changing a single line of code. My Dilemma I have used Custom Business Objects since that gives me a clearer OOP representation of the problem scope in my solution scope, and helps me visualize my entire solution as collection of objects with data and behavior rather than having a set of relational data (DataSet) and implement behaviours (business logic, validation) etc. separately. With rich databinding support in .NET 2.0 binding Custom Business Objects to UI was a breeze. Now while building my business objects, I am still in a dilemma about representation of collections in business objects. Currently I am using DataSets to represent collections while I have seen many suggestions to implement custom collections. For example, in my vision, a typical Sale Invoice Object will contain 'Sales Invoice Items' as a collection. Now theoritically, I can accept that the each 'Sales Invoice Item' should have its own behavior along with their data (ItemCode, Name, Qty, Price etc.) but typically managing of Sale Invoice Items in a Sale Invoice is handled by the Sale Invoice Object itself, e.g. adding/removing Items from collection. Additionally, we can also put business logic/rules for the Sales Invoice Items like "Qty should not be greater than the ordered qty", "Price should be max 10% above the price in Sale Order" etc. in the Sale Invoice object itself. With that kind of a vision, I felt that most business object child collections can be managed by the parent itself, including add/remove from collection as well and implementing business logic for the collection items, hence the collection items hold nothing but data. Additionally, typical collections are represented in UI in Grids, where ability to support DataBinding becomes very important for any collection. Implementing a custom collection, in that case would also mean, I have to implement robust DataBinding support as well, for the collection, which is of course time consuming. Now, considering child collection behaviors are implemented in the parent and the need for DataBinding of child collections, I chose DataSet to represent any child collection in my business objects. In the above example of Sale Invoice I will have 'Invoice Number', 'Date', 'Customer' etc. as attributes of the 'Sale Invoice' but 'InvoiceItems' as a DataSet. Of course, when I say DataSet, it is not a vanilla dataset but an extended DataSet that supports business rule validation and the same role based security model of my framework to allow/deny any business operation to rows/columns of the DataSet, automatically. This approach has allowed easier collection management and databinding in my business objects and my developers are able to deliver modules rapidly. Questions Do you feel that the approach is reasonable? Do you see any shortcomings of this approach? I am recently thinking of using 'Typed DataSets' as child collections, for easier representation in code, that will allow me to write 'currentInvoice.InvoiceItems' (for the DataTable) and 'invoiceItem.ProductCode' or 'invoiceItem.Qty', instead of 'drow["ProductCode"].ToString()' or '(int)drow["Qty"]' etc. Does this choice have any demerits? Thank you if you have read so far and a salute if you still have the Energy to answer.

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